Forgive and Forget

Why I Rejected Christianity: A Former Apologist Explains

Why I Rejected Christianity: A Former Apologist Explains by John Loftus


While reading this book I came across some interesting questions about punishment and forgiveness.

  1. Does justice really demand this much punishment?
  2. If God became incarnate to relate to us, then why can’t he also see what sin is from our perspective?
  3. Did Jesus really suffer an infinite punishment for our sins?
  4. In order for someone to be forgiven why must there be punishment at all?
  5. Even if punishment is needed, then how does punishing Jesus help God forgive us?

As Mr. Loftus points out, can it seriously be true that justice demands I suffer for all eternity in hell for one little white lie? I understand that is taking it a bit far, but what about other biblical examples of forgiveness without punishment - the prodigal son, in the Lord’s prayer, and the publican? All they had to do was ask.

Why can’t God see us as we are, as he made us? Most of us, most of the time are good and do good things. Some of us, some of the time do bad things. Most people do not do bad things to piss God off, shouldn’t God know that? Especially since he was one of us?

Since when does forgiveness equal punishment? To me the greater act is to forgive when there is no recompense. I can forgive without someone being punished, why can’t God? And even if punishment was required, as in to teach a lesson, then how does punishing Jesus make it easier for God to forgive us? If my employee screwed up opening the store in the morning and I thought he needed to be punished both to teach him a lesson and to make it easier for me to forgive him, what good would it do to punish his co-worker instead? That doesn’t make sense. Nor would it make any sense for me to punish myself for the “sins” of my employee. “Someone’s got to pay” doesn’t seem like a loving thing to me. Divine forgiveness should be forgiveness with understanding and open arms.

“I, for example, do not believe in a God who willed Jesus to suffer for my sins. I do not believe in a God whose inner need for justice is satisfied when his son is nailed to a cross. I regard the substitutionary version of the atonement as a barbaric attack on both the truth of God and the meaning of human life.”

John Shelby Spong - Rescuing the Bible from Fundamentalism





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2 Responses to “Forgive and Forget”

  1. John W. Loftus Says:
    October 30th, 2006 at 10:15 am

    Thank you for these posts! Email me if you’d like to come be a team member at debunking Christianity. I’m always looking for a woman’s perspective there.

  2. Theresa Frasch Says:
    November 7th, 2006 at 6:43 am

    As a matter of fact…I read it at your house a couple of visits ago. See, you keep me on my toes and up to date.

    Did you read his new book “Letter to a Christian Nation?” I wish it was required reading for every middle-of-the-road, in name only, Christian. Devout Christians would not be able to stomach it, I am afraid, but if the ones who were fence sitters read it they might take a reasonable look at their faith and realize they don’t have much faith at all, they’ve just gone along with the crowd because that is how they were brought up.

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